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135109 No.133039  

I don't care for the overall worldview most people have in San Francisco, but I love their 10/10 sexy rail transit system. Multiple types + a few of them use historic equipment + world's last manually-operated cable car system. Is there any city with a sexier medley of public rail transit services? I doubt it.

>> No.133045  

>>133039I dunno man, Japanese cities are pretty cool in terms of transport.

>> No.133046  

>>133045
Cite at least one specific example, please.

>> No.133048  

>>133039
They might have the most separate modes of public transit in any city

>Metro
>Commuter rail
>LRT/Streetcar
>Bus
>Trolleybus
>Ferry
>Cable Car
>> No.133049  

I was taken completely by surprise during my time at the tourist traps in San Francisco, to find such a fascinating array of old trolleys/streetcars in regular revenue service.

http://www.streetcar.org/streetcars/

>> No.133051  

>>133046 -- You might want to have a look at Hiroshima and its 'working tramway museum' for one. Hiroden owns and runs about a century's worth of trams.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiroshima_Electric_Railway

There are also the Astram AGT and JR West's San'yo lines, plus a gaggle of buses.

>> No.133054  
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428868

>>133048
I looked this up recently. Although several US cities have a wide array of public transit options like SF, only two cities have all five main types of land-based transit AND are controlled by one entity: Philadelphia, via SEPTA (Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority); and Boston, via MBTA (Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority). Between these two, Boston wins because MBTA also runs ferries.

In SF, Muni (San Francisco Municipal Railway) controls the light rail lines, buses, and trolleybuses, but the rapid transit/subway, commuter rail, and ferries are run by different organizations.

>> No.133065  

>>133051
I didn't realize the Hiroshima system also had modern rolling stock. Sorry to go off-topic but why don't Japanese rolling stock makers push their trams to foreign markets? The Green Mover Max looks like it would make a great competitor to the Citadis or Urbos series.

>> No.133069  
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1874550

>>133065
Regulations, "special needs" (the Japanese have a take it or leave it tendency. At most you'll see someone like Hitachi bend over. But even if you look at it, it's just a copy and paste A-Train). Japanese stock is pretty much always suited to the Japanese environment and they care little for overseas.
Especially with regards to tram, the original Greenmover was a Siemens Combino (which broke so the Japanese made the Greenmover Max). Bombardier also did tram designs for Fukui - distinctly non Japanese in the sense that it has sealed windows.

>> No.133070  

>>133069
How the hell can large rolling stock makers sustain from sales from one market? I know the Japanese cycle through rolling stock in a matter of years but surely the national demand can't be that high.

>> No.133071  
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154991

>>133070
It's not the only thing many of the companies make. Selling rolling stock internationally is really just icing on the cake for many of them as they rarely get really big contracts, just little bits here and there. Now that Tokyu Car Corporation is pretty much part of JR East - they do their rolling stock in house top-down. What little external hardware there is, is either sourced externally because they can't do it in house, or for shits and giggles. As a topic of personal interest, this was a thing with the air conditioners used on some trains. JR East can do them in house via TransporTec but they get some (of the same design, mildly different in appearance) from Mitsubishi Electric anyway. Same thing with Hitachi trains which some do use Hitachi aircons but some also use Toshiba units. Or the N700 which uses aircon units from both Toshiba and Mitsubishi Electric - except they're pretty much identical in spec and appearance.
In the inverter space, it's really just Hitachi which is self sufficient. And with bogies, it's everyone supplying everyone.

Others like Alna Sharyo though are just small makers and probably get by likewise. Beyond that, they also get money through constant rolling stock programs.

Curiously, the domestic cost for Japanese rolling stock is relatively cheap. Considering the Alstom garbage thrown at us here (lacking even the basics such as air spring suspension because the government cheaped out) costs as much as a Shinkansen per carriage, I'm always left amused and appalled at how the government lets itself get gypped.

>> No.133073  

>>133070 -- Newbuilds, rebuilds, upgrades, updates...

Many sharyos (car makers) might also buy in parts from companies like https://www.toyodenki.co.jp/en/

>> No.133074  

Toyo Denki, like Alna Sharyo that @James mentioned above, is a member of http://www.jorsa.or.jp/en/ (Japan Overseas Railway Systems Association).

>> No.133077  

>>133071

>Curiously, the domestic cost for Japanese rolling stock is relatively cheap

Doesn't that come down to labour being cheaper and the trains having ridiculously short useful lifespans? As terrifying to even thin bout it, the Xtrapolis units will probably outlive whatever stock JRE is using right now.
Would it be possible to make the same comparison using rolling stock built in the JNR era when Japan was at its economic peak and when they still built rolling stock to last? I imagine the difference would be much smaller.



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